I am part of the first dual degree batch. In the beginning there were 60+ of us. After 5.5 years and about a 100+ research papers later, most of us are still here. The question most of me and my batch mates are asking ourselves is "What next ?". Circumstances have conspired to make us unwanted by most and looked at skeptically by the remaining.
As the placement process unravels it's becoming clearer that our degrees, our work and our orientation is becoming an unbearable burden. Companies feel that we are either too "research minded" to work for them or likely to run away for a PhD. So most want nothing to do with us. Those who are ok with us, tend to have a selection process we are ill prepared for. If somebody were to ask me about crypto or cvit people about vision or Sarika about RoboCup we would blow them out of the water. Sadly nobody seems to want to ask us these things. It seems that data structures and puzzles are the flavor of the day. Most ug4's have spent the last 2 months, working very hard to prepare for the placement season. Most of us have spent the last 2 months making a final thrust to get that last paper accepted or to start giving shape to our thesis. Not an ideal scenario.
The faculty would like to believe that having exposed us to top class research, many of us would be motivated to pursue higher studies. 2 out of 60+ have gone for a PhD. Not numbers to go wild about. This begs the question : Has IIIT created a (confused)monster with it's dual degree programs ?
While I leave this question as a topic for open debate, I do have a few questions about the dual degree program.
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Section 1 : Jobs
Q1: Are there relevant jobs for 60 dual degree graduates in Computer science and Electronics ?
Q:2 Has the institute (faculty) spent enough time educating companies about the dual degree program ?
Q3: Has the institute made an effort to educate companies that the hiring process they follow for ug's is not optimal for MSbR
Q4: Has each faculty member asked himself how he can help get his students a job ?
Q5: Do the Institute and the faculty have a burden of responsibility to help get a student a job ?
Q6: Are all faculty members in agreement with or even aware of this ?
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Section 2: The Research
Q1: Has there been an effort to normalize/standardize the quality of MS thesis' ?
Q2: Has there been an effort to analyze the quality of research work done as part of this program?
Q3: Have we asked ourselves if we are publishing for the sake of publishing ?
Q4: Have all students been provided the means to present their research work at the relevant forums (i.e. sponsorship for conferences) ?
Q5: Do we provide enough faculty and by extension research areas for our students to work on?
Q6: Do we always have the resources to help a student complete his/her work ?
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Section 3: The program itself
Q1: Almost all the dual degree students will complete their degree in 6 years. In this aspect is the program satisfactory?
Q2: Why is the proportion of students from DD interested in pursuing a PhD so dismal ?
Q3: Has the institute thought about students stuck in the program even unable to do their B.Tech ?
Q4: Does an average High School student understand what he is getting into when choosing DD?
Q5: Has the institute taken initiatives to ensure that every DD student is at least paid a minimum stipend apart from a tuition wavier?
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Questions for the future:
Q1: Considering the issues computer science and electronics dual degree students have, was it prudent to introduce other courses like PostBSc, DD in computational natural sciences and DD in computational linguistics ?
Q2: Will we have a complete overhaul in the way we go about dealing with the DD students and their future aspirations, be it a job or a PhD or even an MBA ?
Q3: Is the institute going to clean up it's act when it comes to financial planning, to ensure students are paid a decent stipend and provided adequate funds for presenting their research work?
PS1: For fellow students - Don't write comments in a moment of frustration/anger. Think before you write.
PS2: For others - Don't write rhetorical junk. Appreciate reality, and yes....Think before you write too.
31 comments:
Reality bites.
MS by Research programme is not the one I completely appreciate as I graduate from the course after 3.5 yrs. Whether DD programme or MS by Research PG programme both face similar music.
At the end of degree, as Rishab mentioned we are not ready for placements, and the industry is not ready for us.
Advisors just shrug away saying they can't do anything. Indeed, I haven't seen them do anything. In the MS2k6 batch - no one could place themselves in any thing near to research placement. Of course, recession was a factor, but advisors shrugging away from the problem is no solution. After all, these were research students who joined MS by Research programmes leaving their jobs.
No conclusions to be drawn, but a lot to think about, by a lot of people. :-|
Well - if you manage to say I did crypto and i am good for nothing else. GFU ..... Research is supposed to teach you how to tackle any problem. What i am trying to say is - you should have learnt a general framework to tackle every problem!
I am not flaming you. May be there is something wrong in the process at your college. may be you fellas are not true researchers - may be you are just claiming to be so :-) may be! May be you are lazy and even afraid to accept the truth :-) Placements are survival of the fittest. I think you guys have deteriorated over time. This is in the sense of your technical abilities when compared to the 4th years. I doubt you can beat a first year in calculus, probability and other math ! Do not tell me research tells you to forget the basics - you are allowed to if only you have the capability to derive it instantaneously.
I think you guys have to be broad, accept things that you have to be good at everything and intellectually shrewd.
More than it - work hard :)
I would suggest the following - stop bitching and get along, this is life :)
You guys need to rethink - that even after 5 odd years of training you are not able to clear the written exams -- i seriously think you need to go back to the basics.
Given you guys do not understand the basics of DS, OS, CS and math in general -- i wonder what research you will be doing !
@Anonymous
Every person has a fixed amount of energy. As you focus your energies on depth in a certain area for a very long time, your breadth knowledge and retention are likely to suffer. It is the case not only with MS students at IIIT but also for any MS/PhD students at the best places in the world like MIT and Berkley. You would be surprised at how many students fail to clear PhD qualifiers(that are considered elementary) at such places as they proceed in their work. Also placements are no better than some random heuristics. If you are asked the K-Sum of a bst, failure to answer that doesn't mean anything. It's just a reflection on your level of preparation for the placement process.
@Anonymous: Dude. You need to calm down. I dont know what kind of animosity you hold against the people of Dual Degree but ranting against them in a comment(anonymously) is not done. Rishabh has raised some very valid points and you have managed to divert the attention completely to a DD vs non DD discussion.
@rishabh: Placement processes are random and arbitrary(remember bhaggo). Everywhere and every time. You guys need specialised placements which the institute is not in a position to provide, both due to lack of willingness and expertise. Its sad that the situation has come down to this but the placements have just started. Many other companies are yet to come and you guys should ideally look at applying off campus in companies with requirements for your expertise in specialised fields.
@Anonymous
What a naive opinion!
A placement written exam doesnt measure breadth or depth. It measures sharpness/speed. To give a stupidly simple example, 5.5 years into an electronics dual program, I can still write a small program for a BST sort - something I did 5 years back.
That hasnt changed. What HAS changed, is that I now take twice as much time to do it - I first need to think what a BST sort was all about, get the semantics right in C (being so used to matlab), ponder on the concept of a Linked List and then proceed to write it all in, with no error.
A few hours of slogging will get me back to the same conceptual level as I used to be, but that coding speed will not be as easy to get back.
Besides, a course a DD person did 3 years back, the BTehcs did 1 year back, so refreshing ones memory will obviously take longer.
I do have a readymade solution I would recommend to all duals - work harder than them. Problem solved.
Well, you raised some pretty good points.
We could probably think about 2 key points from your post:
1) Why do IIIT MSBR students take a large time to graduate and how that could be optimized/reduced?
2) How should it be ensured that IIIT MSBR students get research jobs?
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For no 1, I personally feel that IIIT lacks the processes to control or give proper feedback on time to the MSBR students. It is very very common for students to get stuck, and when they get stuck, they get frustrated, loosing time.
There could be 2 ways to provide feedback:
1) Have a semester wise Black Friday as in Carnegie Mellon, which is like a semi-annual review of the progress of each student (also the faculty adviser) and marks their progress, and at times gives clear directions in terms of tasks to be done next semester. Not only this could give students some intermediate goals, but it could also save time and money for both the institute and the students.
2) Introduction of seminars having credits where each student has to present his research progress which is reviewed by the registered students and faculty. Not only these these small presentations help you to clarify your own thoughts but they could also tremendously help towards collaboration and learning within a group (and across groups).
I guess group presentations are common at IIIT, but what I suggest is making it formal by allocating credits and making it a compulsory semester course for MSBR students.
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For no 2, i.e, jobs.
Well if you just browse through the alumni list of IIIT, and compare the current position of MSBR students with the BTechs, the MSBR's have done pretty good. Although it is understandable that current job scene is bad, and the first thing which gets sacrificed are the research jobs in a downtime.
There could be one solution for this.
IBM Research, MSR, SETLabs, HPlabs etc all offer internships for an year or two. (I guess IBM pays around 50K pm for interns, so that is even a pretty good financial option.) If you request the Dean R&D (Dr PJN) to initiate efforts for such specific short term (or long term) positions in the industry, that might be a viable option for MSBR students. I believe currently it's the advisers who are responsible to a certain extent, but that does not always work out.
BITS Pilani manages to get 100s of students to practice stations, I wonder why a few handful of guys in MSBR@IIIT can't be provided with such an option.
But then, jobs are less of an issue. If you are smart, you would always manage a good one.
But having appropriate processes for MSBR students where their progress is monitored and they are provided all help when necessary is the need of the hour.
@MSbR alumni
In your days how many msbr people graduated in a go ? 5,6,7 ..10 ??
This year there are 60 Dual degree students and about 10~15 more Ms students. Thats about 75~80 research students. Where do you fit 80 people ? We have not dealt with such numbers before and the faculty is unprepared to deal with it despite having 6 years to do so :(
@anonymous
have got it all wrong,.. but turns out that is the naive thinking of every1 else out there, so I will take his example to explain few things here.
(would like to assume "crypto" as a variable here)
1. Practically, research DOES mean that if a person has done Crypto then he ACTUALLY IS good for nothing else. (and nothing else here does not mean that that person becomes c++ deficient, c++ is a tool, not science).
2. The above is the reason people do research bcoz, since their contribution to science/technology is so narrow, it becomes of very high quality.
3. "How to do research" tells us how to tackle any problem. once i know how to do research, i choose a theme, a field and thus researching in crypto automatically does not make me a bozo in every other field.
4. Having said point 1, wanted 2 clarify, people do change their field sometimes but it takes years (since research in crypto does not make me superman to tackle any problem of non-crypto fields, as said b4)
5. In your final statement, u just mixed science and technology, and research and engineering. Knowing or not knowing basics of technology has nothing to do with capability of research.
6. the research students here dont get the important 2 months study time that those 4th yrs are getting. its not their incompetence in solving a calculus equation or writing "towers of hanoi" in a minute. You somehow hav incredible amount of disrespect towards msbr people.
7. by just writing "i m not flaming you" does not at all make it sound polite.
8. you do make sense in ur 3rd paragraph however, but that is not a solution at all. its one of the agendas.
9. ur 4th paragraph...., it is 5 years of incremental training, it is not: doing calculus or writing towers of hanoi every year. that is the reason even those 4th yr students need those 2 months to go back to the basics.
10. Companies shud dig these guys properly, YES assure themselves for basics, but more importantly, see how much him/her is polished, and how well he/she can be harnessed. And the institute, also, should give them proper opportunities and not shrug away. I dont really know the proper vision of our institute, so i cannot comment on what iiit thinks of DD or msbr students, but wat i knew, i tried 2 put here.
@rishab : nice post .... raised many valid questions needed to be answered by the institute.
But these issues should never die on this blog ....
@Badri : I will completely agree with you but working hard ( ofcourse cannot do more than that) now may not give the optimal solution to get placed in this season. By the time we get speed most of the good companies will get passed. Of course will be helpful if you are applying for off-campus later which takes more
time.
But one thing can be said for sure is we would have been placed in a better company if we were placed 2 years back than the placement we get now. Who should be blamed for this?
Anywhere first batch will be the victims. Now we are now going to be the victims of the programme. The problem is institute never takes proper care of the first batch, it just wait and see what's gonna happen next. If a problems occurs then it tries to see same problem won't occur for next batch. Ideally it should see what's problem the batch gonna face in next six months and prevent it. Institute never keep an observation on such things.
One of the serious problem with DD is, we are dragged into this programme ( mini-phd which Prof.PJN refers as ) without our interest. This programme can be done sucessfully by a student only if he is interested in it. Otherwise it's going to take long time or might be the case he cannot finish it. I do not understand what action the faculty is gonna take about such students who are neither interested in this programme nor get out of the institute and proceed them to the next level of their lives. This is just they are playing with students life.
Basically this programme .....
Well I guess the author has raised some decent points. I am sure people would have 100s of criticisms about the program, but it might be worthwhile that they provide alternatives, as mere criticisms would turn into rants.
I am quite positive about the MSBR program in general, and IIIT in particular, so may be we would have differing opinions.
But then, I have my criticisms too, and here are some:
1) Exit route for people not interested in pursuing MS?
What should be the best way? There are some pretty smart people who did not really get "any degree" (not even a BTech). Some of them are doing quite good in the industry. But the point is, can we have practical rules to handle such scenarios?? (and I am sure there would be many when the program scales)
2) Too much emphasis on papers at IIIT
We can quickly run into philosophy if we come to discuss this, and I don't really have an alternative answer. But I seriously feel that huge list of papers hanging outside CVIT (if it still does) is nothing but stupidity. Its not good research, and its not teaching people what is good research. Doing research is a lot about problem solving, exploring, building new stuff, and often failing in the process. Writing a paper is just one component. Expecting a paper count for research from a masters student who is/should-be "learning to do research" is simply not correct.
3) Asking students who pass out of 12th to commit to not only research but also a research area (NLP/CS...) and basically using AIEEE rank for the same.
At our time (and some of our juniors) most of the dual degree students were those who switched to the program in their 3rd year when they had an idea about what they wanted to do. Interestingly "all" those guys who had originally opted for a dual degree while joining had dropped out and graduated with a bachelors degree. I guess the option to opt in to the program still exists, but the option to opt out is now gone. Is that so? And should that be considered?
4) "5 year program" misnomer
The institute calls the dual degree program a 5 year program, but it does not remain a 5 year program in strict sense, and people have spent up-to 8 years for the same.
Part of the problem is that IIIT still does not have a proper process to manage MSBR students. Most of these students are basically learning to do research, and it should be treated like that. There have to be proper mechanisms in place to review the performance of individuals, give them feedback, and even remove people who are not performing and/or not interested.
wondrful post! hav been waiting for someone to write something like this all along!!
>>This year there are 60 Dual degree students and about 10~15 more Ms students. That's about 75~80 research students. Where do you fit 80 people ?
Rishabh, that is a challenge. But I still feel placements are not the end of the world. I think if you are good, it takes no more than 3 months to get into "any company".
Anyways best wishes !!
@ An MSBR Alumni
The questions I have posed shouldn't be trivially dismissed as rants or criticisms. They are questions, I feel are worth asking and I assure you that they have strong origins.
@anonymous
Take a 6 months break from what you are doing now, and you will have a taste of what a DD or MSbR faces.
--some other stuff--
Let me start by saying that I am happy to be a student of this institute. In my first year at the institute, everyone who asked me whether to join here or not, I would say this is the best place I have ever been. This is my third year as MSbR and now I am not very sure about it. The institute has some of the finest faculty. But, the faculty are all academicians. They are one of the best in their field but in management, I am not sure.
The institute needs serious management advice and training. The flat structure of research centers and no hierarchy seems all good to think but is analogous to no control. There has to be an authority to which every one has to answer or given a flat structure, it is required that periodical auditing must be done which is never done here.
There has to be a black book of rules and regulations made available to every prospecting and current student, and faculty of the institute. The confusion is at its peak when neither the faculty nor the student knows the process. Its not practical for every student in doubt to go to the Dean and present his case. These set of rules must be conformed to and whenever an exception is made, it must be added to the corresponding section.
The institute is run by professors who dreamt of being researchers and became researchers. The faculty must understand that when they were in their Undergraduate, it would have been only 10% of the batch who dreamt of being researchers and out of those 5% went on to become researchers. My estimates are based on what I have observed in the past batches. So, hoping that each one of the students at the institute will be interested in RESEARCH will remain a DREAM for a very long time. Till then, the faculty must accept and plan according to how the present batch is. Forcing one to do research is worser.
The institute markets its DD program as 2 degrees in 5 years. Let us assume that there is a batch for DD's who completed it in 5 years. Now what about their placements? If the institute believes that every DD or MSbR student will pursue higher studies even after DD or MSbR, why not offer a "Triple Degree" which is B.TECH + MSbR + PhD. If there was a Triple Degree, and one student was in final year of his/her Triple Degree, who shall take the responsibility of getting this student a job? According to my knowledge there is no degree institute in the world which says that "We are not interested in placements." Each student has limited capabilities and this is a very competitive world. There will always be those who will need support. If the institute doesn't provide it then who will?
With no order in the institute, chaos prevails. How this institute survives then? We as Indians are very optimistic. A third year undergraduate seeing his senior not getting placed will think - the situation will surely improve next year. A MSbR student like me will want to get into any company seeing that two of his senior passouts are still searching for a job in their research areas.
That this country doesnt have enough niche jobs has been a well known fact . I am surprised that all 60+ of you actually expected specialised jobs in your respective streams .
Industry by and large has very very few research positions. And if you are expecting one in your domain it will never be as easy as a b.tech getting placed in a general programmer job.
My advice is , work a bit harder and try for a normal job . Generally most companies take PGs at one level higher than UG.
But then you might say ... what is the difference between MSBR and M.Tech then .. Hmm .. giving the maturity level of indian industry really i think there is very little.
How many companies can give you purely computer vision jobs .. or purely robotics jobs or purely cognitive science jobs ? (okie this last one is a joke :P ) .. Very few ...
If you are aiming for a niche job never expect the same ease of placement like that of a normal B.Tech who really doesnt aspire for any area as such . He just needs a job :)
i dont know man... I can say that I've slogged for most part of my life and for me, somehow squeezing myself into IIIT-H itself was a huge achievement. But then a slogger like me got in DD program where things cannot be done by slogging as most of the research centers demand good aptitude in math (which I don't have.) People who are better in math are put off by the environment in our institute. That's why there should be a mechanism where profs. can identify who has the potential of going ahead in research and who should be left free...
I absolutely disagree with what a prof. once said - "Even a toddler does research when he learns to walk. Imagine you are a toddler and that learning to walk is your research problem. Like walking research comes naturally to every human being." absolute bs.
Reality Check: Companies (anywhere), even the research ones need solutions. Can you provide those solutions? No one has use for a solution to a robocup competition. You have to provide answers to problems in their field.
While asking fancy data structures and puzzles is not something I am fully condoning when it comes to job interviews, it is essential to prove that you have a solid footing in the basics of computer science. So, you need to prove yourself in DS and over and above your research area. (Puzzles you have to mug up :D)
You need to also realize that there is a wide chasm between what industry needs and what academia teaches. If you need jobs, you need to cater to the wants of the industry. Right? Our software engineering course needs to teach this. Unfortunately it's pretty hopeless!
For instance, May be the DoD cares about a fancy encryption scheme. Most companies don't, they would rather buy the solution from an established place like RSA. So if you sit down and write the fancy scheme for them and take 10 days doing it while the product has to ship in a month, they'll not need you anymore :)
But it is the research spirit that you must not kill in yourself. May be there are no companies that work in your field of expertise. May be you can take up a normal job and provide them with the better solutions that your research has taught you. So don't ditch a job just because it's not in your favoured research area.
Good post, and for a change, mostly well thought out comments.
During my 4 years in college, I saw these questions, if not in the same words, at least in spirit being raised again and again. But they always fell on deaf ears.
People running the place are completely obsessed with their vision of "A World Class Research University", but they do not see the serious roadblocks they are stumbling upon. There seems to be no clear plan or priorities for the institute.
And the cynic inside me, tells me that it is not going to change.
Rishab,
In the Indian industry, many HR folks do not give much credit for *any* degree beyond a B.Tech, be it Ph.D./M.S./M.Tech whatever. As a token of respect you may get a little more in terms of salary--thats all. So it no wonder that the evaluation process is same as that of a B.Tech. However I may quickly add that things are much better now than say 10 years back and improving. If IIIT is serious in getting good deals for its research folks, it needs to do serious lobbying at the national level to change this attitude. Indian HR lives in a prehistoric age.
I would also like to add that nowhere in the world (not even in US) is it possible for everyone to get a job exactly relevant to your MS or PhD thesis. Ph.D. is not a Doctorate in CS, it in Philosophy and MS is as you said a mini-Ph.D.
Research exposure that you get will
stand you in good stead even if you take up ordinary jobs. However there are few interesting jobs around, "research" them out and apply on your own through friends and contacts. Campus placement is a basic assistance provided by an institute to its students. If you want something beyond that, try separately.
Good luck.
--An outsider who sometimes posts on education related blogs
I am a student of the first batch of Post B.Sc. I also happen to be the only one of the two students who had joined in 2006. The other dropped out in our second year.
The vision behind this course was to educate people from pure science background about computer science and IT and how it can be used as a tool to solve real life problems in Science.
Like the other dual degree students, Post BSc students too suffer from the problem of limited job opportunities in their domain.
A professor here once told me that the purpose of the program gets defeated if a Post BSc student goes for a regular IT job. Instead she should go for a PhD. My natural reaction to this is that personally, the idea of doing a regular IT job does not appeal to me either, but the fact is that I have very few choices!
When I joined here for the dual degree programme, part of the reason was that I wasn't really sure if I wanted to commit 5+ years of my life to a PhD (in addition to 2 yrs for MSc). I thought pursuing MSbR would at least tell me if I really want to do it. And if I happen to conclude that that is not the case, I would at least have a B.Tech. degree to my name which will guarantee a decent standard of living. I do not say that I have figured out that PhD is not my cup of tea, but it is definitely not something I wish to do immediately.
At this point in time, I wish to work in my domain for at least a couple of years. But like Rishabh and several others have pointed out, there are only a handful of companies working in our research fields. Computational Chemistry, Biology and Physics are emerging fields and the limited opportunities make entries to these places highly competitive.
I have no idea where I will land up, but I hope all turns out well in the end. I know I have left a lot to destiny but that has how it has been since I decided to come to this place!
ideally, i would say that at least more than half of the MSBR students should have been interested in pursuing a PhD ... as that is definitely not the case, there is certainly something fundamentally wrong in the way the institute is handling its research students.
>> there is certainly something fundamentally wrong in the way the institute is handling its research students.
Yes, indeed. There is a list.
1. Asking people between AIEEE rank 1300 - 2200 to do research because they got those 2 marks less to graduate with a BTech.
2. And the best of all taking btw 2400- 2800 for computational science or linguistics even though these guys just graduated from 12th exams and have no clue what is NLP and what is research.
3. Once these actually start doing some work leaving them alone with clear directions to "publish or perish", with almost no exit option.
The list goes on...
PS:: You can replace the above numbers with the last AIEEE cutoffs
Lets have a face to face discussion with the faculty(esp Kamal & PJN ), and fire these questions at them. Lets have a FSIS
Other things : MS should be done if a person is willing to. There must be an option for converting to 4-year courses, if a students wants to. Else assurity must be given for decent placements.
Placement situation seems to be worse for dual degree's .... see the following stat
There is no DD student in the list of 31 students shortlisted by a company x. Note that there are more than 20 btech guys who have been placed before this company visited the campus which includes PPO's and there are more than 30 DD students who are sitting for the placements.
See the preparation gap ......
Placement situation seems to be worse for dual degree's .... see the following stat
There is no DD student in the list of 31 students shortlisted by a company x. Note that there are more than 20 btech guys who have been placed before this company visited the campus which includes PPO's and there are more than 30 DD students who are sitting for the placements.
See the preparation gap ......
I think all the DD's should demand another season of placement later in month of march or april.
Someone is responsible for messing up with lifes,careers and aspirations of students.
You are tricking a 16-17 year old student who doesn't know meaning of research into a DD program so you can get more people in your lab. So that you can head a larger research group.
This is genocide of aspirations of 17year olds who at the time of joining did not knew what future holds for them.
You have created a system where students are frustrated, they hate the institute to core and want to get out of this place.
Only 2 Phd's out of a mini PhD program. Is still something more needed to be said. This is dismall for a research institute. Isn't it Mr. PJN?? If at all you listen?
This had to happen. Out of 60+ students of every batch of IIIT 50+ think coming to IIIT as DD students was greatest mistake of their life.
There is time left. Atleast give people an option to convert back to CSE this time. The blessings you will get will be much more than any satisfaction heading a larger group can give you.
Show some humanity.
"IISc is an institution set up to provide a luxurious life for egotists and lunatics while they pretend to be professors. Of all the professors there, perhaps 1% make the grade to qualify as good human beings. "
Does it holds true for IIIT?
Lets wait and see.
Lack of Accountability.
This is a deemed university. People(Faculty) can do whatever experiment they want and can get away without any responsibility.
Why not call some India Today and Outlook journalist and publish statistics of Our GREAT RESEARCH INSTITUTE'S almighty DUAL DEGREE program. Then India will come to know how great we are. We don't care for placements. We are not like other degree granting universities. Why not compare these stats with likes of VIT or say some college? Let's see how a game changer institute fares against them???
After all we have changed the scene of technical education in India.
"We have introduced a niche course which doesn't cater to needs of anyone." Isn't it a great research. We fellas must understand that this was the research for which INAE fellowship was bestowed. "Such a great world class research which directly makes an impact in lives of students". Can't someone nominate Prof PJN for Nobel Prize?? He too had partnered in this great research.
@ The two anonymous people above.
Your comments are rather strange. As someone who has gone through the DD program, I can attest to the academic quality of the program. Almost no student B.Tech or DD at any IIT has anywhere near the quality and quantity of research work a DD student has. Any course at any institute is likely to have some problems with it. Now you can call people names and be sarcastic (like you guys have done) or you can participate in constructive criticism. Viewing a course as good/bad based on merely placement statistics is really stupid. Having seen so many placement seasons at a college that is always within the top 5 nationally, I can say that placement is 30% student quality, 50% luck. And the remaining 20% is absolute randomness.
Also personal attacks on faculty members is uncalled for. Over the years I have had a lot of philosophical disagreements with the faculty, but I can say that they do care, and at times it seems to be at odds with what we perceive as "good". Remember you are here for some years. They have a long term vision. Have a little faith. By all means criticize, debate and discuss. But think for 5 mins before you erupt.
@shark
I don't doubt the quality of reserch work done.
I say who needs this quality. Balantly putting it "There are very few research jobs in industry. And for those jobs Phd's are required. Other jobs are regular IT jobs. They require regular IT skills."
Now for God sake atleast allow 3rd and 4th year people to convert to CSE. You can't place them, you can't provide them good stipeds. The only thing you can do to make their life better is to convert or to atleast allow them to leave this place in 5 years.
Don't give an MS, a BTech will be more than enough. MS is anyway a waste.
When will this FSIS happen?
Prof PJN said to Prashant Gopal and others that their will soon be a FSIS with DD's. Had it happened then situation might have been a bit better.
I would surely like to ask why was DD course in IIIT introduced at all?
If introduced why was it marketed with high paying industry R&D jobs?
Why did they said this course has an advantage because you get 2 degrees in 5 years?
http://www.iiit.ac.in/admissions/undergraduate/faqs#2
Who is responsible and who is paying for all these mishups?
Should the person not take moral responsibility and resign from all his posts and DD program should not be abandoned??
Is it enough to say that first batch has to suffer everywhere???
What was actually the agenda for introducing this course? "Preparing students for R&D jobs or increasing strength of research labs???"
Why not give current students an option to convert to CSE?
How many current students actually want to do research?
How many of DD students regretted this decision very first day they arrived in this institution??
Is this a way to make an institution world class? where your students don't trust you, don't trust your intentions???
I need answers!!!!
@shark
Why don't you offer a poll on your blog asking shall DD people be given an option to convert into BTech Honors?? For benefit of institute,institute gets to take 80% of first year salary of such converts...
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